[Homer2009-1] Odyssey Discussion Questions

Thu Nov 12 19:55:03 UTC 2009

I have to second Andre's recommendation of Shay's book.  It is
heartbreaking.  I have a friend, Tom Palaima, who teaches this book with
the Iliad.  He also compares it to Tim O'Brien's The Things They
Carried.  

From: homer2009-1-bounces at readingodyssey.org
[mailto:homer2009-1-bounces at readingodyssey.org] On Behalf Of Andre
Stipanovic
Sent: Thursday, November 12, 2009 1:19 PM
To: homer2009-1 at readingodyssey.org
Subject: Re: [Homer2009-1] Odyssey Discussion Questions

Thanks very much Pauline!  I think the article is well written and
Caroline Alexander's book looks very interesting and especially timely.
I would add to this discussion, Jonathan Shay's book Achilles in
Vietnam.  Shay is a psychiatrist who interviewed many Vietnam War vets.
He noticed patterns in soldiers' PTSD that were reflected in characters
in the Iliad.  With the Iliad under my belt, I couldn't put Shay's book
down once I started reading it.  Homer is able to reflect basic human
responses across 2000 years in both his Odyssey and Iliad.  What a
writer!

Andre

homer2009-1 at readingodyssey.org writes:

Hi all, 

In light of Veterans Day, this opinion piece appeared in yesterday's NY
Times:

Back From War, but Not Really Home

by Caroline Alexander

A sense of dislocation has been shared by veterans returning from war
since Homer conjured Odysseus' inauspicious return some 2,800 years ago.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/11/08/opinion/08alexander.html?_r=1&scp=3&sq
=odyssey&st=cse

We didn't get to discuss this aspect as much during our October session
but it was touched upon in the questions prepared by Andre.  Thanks
everyone and looking forward to next month's discussion.  

Pauline

________________________________

Date: Mon, 9 Nov 2009 11:51:48 -0600

To: homer2009-1 at readingodyssey.org

From: astipanovic at mail.hockaday.org

Subject: [Homer2009-1] Odyssey Discussion Questions

Hi fellow readers of Homer,

Please let these study guide questions for Books 17-24 help you reflect
on your reading.  You may want to wait to read over these until you
finish the book if you don't like finding out about the ending too soon.

We will conclude our discussion of the Odyssey on Monday December 7
(1-888-350-0075; passcode:  1100494#) @8pm EST.  In the meantime, please
feel free to send out your questions to me and to the group so we can
keep the discussion going.  I have enjoyed our discussions so far and
your questions!

Also, please note that Stanley Lombardo will be live on Monday December
14, reading from his translation of the Odyssey.  This is an excellent
opportunity to HEAR the epic (the Greek word "epos" means the uttered
word) from a master translator and reciter.  Sign up online at Reading
Odyssey.

Best,

Andre

Study Guide Questions  - Discussion #3

Books 17-24 Revenge

17-20 Odysseus and Telemachus return to the palace in imminent danger

1.  Book 17 - Omens

As Odysseus first sets eyes on his own palace after 20 years, what are
the ways that he is tested by Athena?  How much restraint is Odysseus
forced to show?  Why?  How do the two omens in Book 17 work with respect
to each other (i.e. Theoclymenus' prophecy and Telemachus' sneeze)?

2.  Book 18 - King of the Beggars

What does the fight between Irus and Odysseus symbolize/foretell?  Book
18 can be said to be important for Amphinomus, one of the suitors.  What
part does he play in the rivalry between Odysseus and the rest of the
suitors?  Why is his part necessary to the story?  Penelope's timed
appearance is significant here.  How does it heighten the mounting
tension of the story?  How does Eurymachus' quarrel with Odysseus at the
end of Book 18 balance that of Odysseus' fight with Irus at the
beginning?

3.  Book 19 - Tease

The reunion of Odysseus and Penelope is somewhat of a tease.  How is
Odysseus able to hold back his feelings?  Is he testing Penelope?  If
so, why should he?  Why is Penelope so steadfast against believing that
Odysseus will come back?

4.  Book 20 - Gods and Prophecies

For all of Odysseus' cleverness and fortitude, he still requires
encouragement to stick with his disguise until it is time for him to
reveal himself.  At what two points do the gods respond to him?  How
manifest are these divine responses to the situation at hand?  What is
Odysseus' main concern in Book 20?  What is Penelope's?  How do these
two differ, yet overlap?

21-24 The contest of the bow and ultimate revenge on the suitors

5.  Book 21 - Contest of the Bow

With Athena prompting Penelope to announce the contest of the bow, the
revenge on the suitors is set into motion.  How much of this plan is
Odysseus in control of?  What is Penelope's role in this overall plan?
What is Telemachus' role in the plan?  Could the plan come together
without Eumaeus' or Philoetus' help?  According to the text of Book 21,
in what parts does Athena actively instigate events?

6.  Book 22 - Anger Unleashed

Although Odysseus' anger is justified, shouldn't he have taken
Eurymachus' offer for compensation after Antinous was killed?  Wouldn't
that have made sense in light of the family feuds and revenge killings
that are sure to follow?  Why does Athena let Odysseus struggle in
combat with the suitors for as long as she does?  Why does she show the
"aegis" when she does, thereby making the suitors flee (p. 345), but not
sooner?  In the midst of the killing, Leodes the soothsayer begs for
mercy.  Leodes was the first to try the bow on p. 326 and foresaw this
calamity, but Odysseus still kills him anyway.  Why?  Phemius the bard
also begs for mercy, but he and Medon the herald are spared.   Why?  Are
the punishments of the serving women and Melanthius just or too harsh?

7.  Book 23 - Aftermath of Slaughter

Ironically, Penelope wakes up from a "sweet sleep" (line 17, p. 353).
Why is she now, all of a sudden, blessed with a "sweet sleep"?  Why does
Penelope continue to hold back from believing that Odysseus has
returned?  If Odysseus himself hadn't killed the suitors, as she says,
then who does she believe has killed them?  Why would this be
frightening to her rather than happy?   How is Penelope finally
convinced that this stranger is her husband?  Penelope finally
recognizes Odysseus as her long-lost husband and Homer uses a simile to
describe the moment (p. 360).  What does the simile show about the
relationship between Penelope and Odysseus?

8.  Book 24 - Shades and Judgment

Book 24 opens by recalling some of the shades in Hades we met in Book
11.  Some commentators say that Agamemnon's and Achilles' conversation
is out of place here.  Is it or is it not?  Why does Odysseus continue
to put on a false front with his father, even after the suitors have
been killed?   Eupeithes, Antinous' father rouses up the Ithacans
against Odysseus.   What sort of threat is posed to Odysseus and his
family?  Zeus makes an irrevocable judgment of the situation on Ithaca.
How does Athena respond to what Zeus says?  Why must Zeus throw a
thunderbolt?  What does the situation on Ithaca show about the Greeks in
general? about the Greeks at Troy?

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